Webflow IX3 Is Great,But You Can Do More

0:22Janne Parri: Bimo, about GSAP. So do you still do everything in custom code? Or do you use the Webflow interactions, the GSAP feature? Or both? And why?

0:35Bimo Tri: Very good question. I'm exclusively coding all of my animation and interaction right now. And there's a reason for that. I just can optimize it further. And there's a lot of utilities and methods that GSAP has if you're doing coding yourself. That are still lacking, not lacking, but actually I don't know how to use it in the GSAP UI in the Webflow native GSAP. I've tried the native Webflow ⁓ GSAP. It's cool. It's the horizontal timeline and then the ability to select nested elements like data attribute, maybe IDs or a lot of custom stuff, but. ⁓

1:17Bimo Tri: I know, man. It's me. I feel like that once I learn how to program, I'm not a developer per se, but once I learn how to do like a lot of like more complex stuff using code, ⁓ I can never look back using it. ⁓ Even like a Webflow. What is it called? Webflow interactions prior to GSAP. Like, I don't know. This is me though.

1:36Janne Parri: Yeah, are there something particular or specific that you kind of miss from the all the custom code stuff that is not yet on the Webflow interaction feature?

1:49Bimo Tri: Control, for example, it could be like a lot of things, right? For example, if I wanted to trigger some elements on the very, very, very first load, not the subsequent refresh of the page and I want to hide things up, I need a logic. To control that and thus trigger the GSAP animation to play all of that. Does that make sense? I feel like I'm saying and that's required the code, not necessarily the GSAP itself, but the code to complete the entire ⁓ experience, ⁓ let's just say. Yeah, that's my reason. ⁓ Not necessarily it's better ⁓ than the native GSAP UI, but...

2:27Bimo Tri: I can, people can do a lot of crazy things with the native ⁓ GSAP UI, make no mistake about it, but I just prefer to do ⁓ that kind of stuff. So yeah, ⁓ hopefully that answer your question, but. ⁓

2:37Janne Parri: ⁓ totally, totally. And I have ⁓ heard some similar ⁓ like, should I say opinions or ways to work from people who have been using GSAP for a while, obviously, they got to be used to doing the custom code stuff. And there are things that you cannot yet do with the ⁓ native thing. So ⁓ that is a good reason to use the custom code. But a very specific question, when you use the custom code, like in the Webflow build, where do you like host or put that custom code? So is it in

3:14Bimo Tri: You

3:14Janne Parri: The page settings or in embed or do you host it somewhere else? Where is it?

3:21Bimo Tri: Oh god, this gets totally technical. I love it. I saw people doing custom code that they do embeds and then they put it into the components or maybe the page and then load the GSAP and everything. ⁓ I find that totally I'm losing the control again. And so that's, host all of my code in GitHub. So I have like a repository, like a starter boilerplate for every project that I run. ⁓ And then I deploy all of the code hosted in Vercel or Netlify, but I'm using Vercel right now. Vercel is like the fastest and connected to the Webflow using script. ⁓

3:59Bimo Tri: And I also have like one small function that checks if I set like a flag in my URL in the browser. If I set like a def equal true in ⁓ the browser, it's going to pull all of the code from my VS code or ⁓ any local dev environment that I have. Or if it's not, then it's going to pull everything from the first cell one that I've already deployed. ⁓ And it's time I save some codes or some update and then I commit it to GitHub. ⁓ GitHub deploying it into the first cell ⁓ and then it gets ⁓ updated into the Webflow

4:33Bimo Tri: Pretty fast. Hopefully that's not too complex but yeah

4:36Janne Parri: Yeah, no, that's why we are like here for the nerdy stuff. But before we go any further, we have to do a little introductions. So my name is Janne Parri. I'm your host today and also a Webflow dude from Finland. And my guest today is Bimo Tri, founder of studio Bamoj, an independent Webflow studio based in Indonesia. Bimo works at the intersection of design and development, building motion rich ⁓ and GSAP powered websites for designer studios, design driven brands. You have actually received quite a few awards and you have also been giving those awards as a awards jury member. But I believe things have not always been like this. So

5:24Janne Parri: I was just listening to the Webflail episode you made with Jack and there you

5:29Bimo Tri: Hmm

5:31Janne Parri: Talked about doing dropshipping and affiliate sites and in my mind if you would have continued with that course you would be some sort of funnel builder or something like that so how did you end up on this more creative side of the internet?

5:46Bimo Tri: That's a good way. I was actually a funnel builder before. So I'm assuming you're familiar with ClickFunnels. Is it,

5:58Janne Parri: Yeah, I am.

5:58Bimo Tri: Or something like ClickFunnels, LeadPages, or things like that. Like, it's essentially technically called... Now that I know it's like a landing page it's not like a funnel I mean like what the fuck is funnel even like is this like a HTML with CSS and some functionality JavaScript so that people can check out and all that and I was a funnel builder doing again dropshipping and affiliate marketing and do we do we want to go into like that kind of backstory right now or

6:29Janne Parri: Yeah, yeah, bring it on, bring it on.

6:30Bimo Tri: Okay, so the love of development is actually coming from my past experience with working in a studio and then the affiliate marketing stuff affiliate marketing stuff like I do create like a website SEO powered website and will publish like a lot of articles using WordPress and oftentimes needs some slight kind of JavaScript embedded kind of snippets in there to make to, what is it called? That kind of to inject the affiliate link. And yeah, I think from there, I started working in agency because,

7:08Bimo Tri: Because my SEO skills and then after the SEO, ⁓ after I work in an agency, ⁓ like I decided to ⁓ work ⁓ on my own self. I mean, being freelance and all that, stumble upon WordPress stuff like ⁓ Divi ⁓ Elementor, and then eventually workflow because of Ran Segall. We all know and love Run for... ⁓ I'm introducing Webflow to the masses, let's just say. I believe it was Ran Segall in Chris Do's video. That was my very first interaction with Webflow. Was like, okay, it's cool. And I still think that back then Webflow is still kind of like, it's alien, right? It's diff. What the fuck is that? Like section.

7:48Bimo Tri: Well, it's still not native to my language at that time. So I was like, and then I took the course. I mean, this is like kind of the simplified or the short story of I took Flux Academy's course, the second or maybe the first iteration actually of Flux and then fell in love with Webflow of the Words and what else? Joseph Berry. Very important role, Joseph Berry and Timothy Ricks ⁓ to one of the biggest, two of the biggest players in Webflow, right? Joseph Berry, it's kind of like, ⁓ Joy is kind of like opening up my mind into what Webflow actually capable of. At that time, before GSAP, obviously, my mindset is like, if I can build this as a designer, as a non-coder, ⁓ right? ⁓ And I can do a lot of this

8:36Janne Parri: Hmm.

8:36Bimo Tri: Crazy stuff. ⁓ I can do I can charge my client like a lot more because back then probably early 2020 or maybe 2019 there are not a lot of like big players that does kind of crazy stuff as Joe did back then so I was like very motivated and then took the course after Flux took the I still remember the course's name. It's called create Award-winning website with Webflow by awards. And the

9:08Bimo Tri: Teacher is Joe Joseph Berry. And I was like, damn, this is the craziest stuff. And yeah, I think after that, after Joe's course, I start to dig into what's possible. And then eventually learning like... I mean, to surpass my limitation at the time, I need to learn programming, like web programming, not necessarily mastering, but like the kind of fundamental of HTML, CSS and JavaScript. What kind of like what's working behind the background. So that's it makes your website running, navigating.

9:45Bimo Tri: Putting on colors, submitting forms and all that so... Dude, yeah, I mean sorry for rambling like a lot, but

9:52Janne Parri: You

9:53Bimo Tri: Yeah, I think that's a serious story and here we are.

9:57Janne Parri: That is so cool. Was it like, well, I guess it was a conscious effort to get more like those, fancy projects with cool animations

10:09Bimo Tri: Fancy.

10:10Janne Parri: And interactions. Was it hard to get to that point? And did you miss the... SEO stuff or the old stuff or was it like gradual change to the to the more visual stuff

10:25Bimo Tri: Think it's gonna be natural for me to gravitate towards something design. I'm not a dedicated designer per se. I just like doing design. Back then, while I was working in agency, doing my best just to design a lot of those funnels. And then sometimes I do ads and... I did not know that I liked design actually at that time until I was learning how to design like very very recently. Recently it's like two to probably three to four years ago and I think it's natural. It's kind of pulling me through into this kind of visual arts stuff. Not necessarily the more...

11:00Bimo Tri: Kind of complex SEO that I did. I think the job is a lot easier when doing that. SEO making that website with a lot of articles that get pranked and then you get the affiliate commission. I think it's way easier. But the job is kind of boring. You didn't get a lot of cool stuff, let's just say that. Just putting an article and then that's it. And I can do it in like 30 minutes to an hour a day of work.

11:28Janne Parri: That's cool. How about like nowadays, how much of your time goes to the development and how much goes to the ⁓ more creative stuff like the designs? And what sort of projects do you have? Going right now.

11:42Bimo Tri: In a client project context. I don't do the design. I have like my designer doing the design and I only do the art direction and the creative direction, like pulling out some wood boards and like the overall stuff meeting with clients. I usually spend at least two to three hours first thing at the start of my work days do like some design work and perhaps getting some mood boards if I need one or something like that and then I spend the rest of my days like doing development because that's gonna take like a lot of most of my time doing devs so so yeah

12:18Janne Parri: I'm curious about that process. You mentioned that you do like the art direction and then you have a different person doing the design. What's your standard process? Do you like to personas you mentioned mood boards? What are like the phases that you go through from the art direction to the design.

12:36Bimo Tri: It's not always in almost every project though if it's a project it's kind of simple they already have like their brand guideline or the direction that they wanted to be in kind of settled in it's kind of make the jobs like a lot easier i just need to design and if i don't have my designers available like i have like a few contracts contractor designers that work for me i did the design myself and if the client needs to have like kind of let's just say like a little blank canvas like we don't know like how to approach our brand or design direction I would start probably asking them a lot of questions starting from like hey what do you want to communicate like what is your brand through essence like it's not kind of like colors and

13:25Bimo Tri: Typography like starting out like that. It's more like kind of the story, the writing. I write a lot when doing this creative direction and art direction. So I need to understand what the company is, what the brand is, what they're, I mean, what they're trying to communicate, what they're, what they wanted to be seen. If, imagine your brand as a person. ⁓ I mean, how is it going to look like? How do they dress? How do they speak? For example, that ⁓ can lead to a lot of different things visually, right? ⁓ If your

13:58Bimo Tri: Brand is kind of like more elegant, maybe a typeface like serif, elegant, ⁓ pretty, line, ⁓ tightly kerned ⁓ what's to the best and like more natural kind of dark color, what's the best? If it's like a funky. They dress certain way, they walk certain way and they wanted to be seen like that their presence online. Obviously the type the typeface choice and color will have to address and to carry that brand to communicate everything. So that's before I get all of the mood boards by the way.

14:30Bimo Tri: This is kind of my work process into art direction. The rest are pretty much the same as any other designers getting mood boards from other brands and then doing some initial layouts, combining typefaces and existing photographs or maybe assets from other brands that kind of look cool. And yeah, dude, it's not kind of like I have like a pretty particular process, but the process of... Designing in our direction and it's pretty much the same like for most designers

15:01Bimo Tri: Essentially

15:03Janne Parri: Or maybe everyone just thinks that it is the same, but everyone has their own. Just maybe. But I wanna like hone in. Although you said that it is quite like ordinary thing, like ordinary mood boards. But you mentioned the future video, like Christo. And back in the day, I used to do like those stylescapes. So do you go so

15:32Bimo Tri: Sounds good, yes?

15:33Janne Parri: Far with the mood boards or do you keep it lean and just throw in some like reference images? So what is the balance? How far you go with the mood boards?

15:45Bimo Tri: I do use to, if it's like a branding project, which I really can get, I do like a mini stylescape. If it's like a website, I really do that. Do I did it? I learned around this from taking the flow party courses. Joe basically, the way I did it is pretty similar. It's making a layout, kind of almost like a stylescape that the feature styles, stylescape. Like you create like a three moods or two, right? And just basically pairing the typeface, the color and the imagery and assets and all that. And if you...

16:21Bimo Tri: Ask how deep I want to go with it. It depends on the client actually. It depends on the scope. If they pay a lot, I'm going to give my everything obviously. But if it's like, hey, this is like a rather short project. If it's like a design dev for context, if it's like a design dev, like, okay, we only have like a month to design and dev this landing page. Of course, I... Don't have much time to work. I'll probably just gather some layout references and some website references and that's all I guess.

16:55Janne Parri: And after that, like you have your art direction, your mood boards, you give those to the designer. And what do you wanna like get from the designer? Like do all the pages, all the screen sizes and are there like specific things that you are like strict about when talking with the designer?

17:17Bimo Tri: Give my designers free exploration, do whatever you want. This is again, going to be depends on project to project to client. I say, if you get like right now, my current project is I get to essentially free canvas. They need design direction and web design and then dev. Right now what I'm doing is that I don't have like a lot of strict rules for him to design. I just need like design in grid like and that's necessarily dictate how many columns of grid you want to use. Just like...

17:52Bimo Tri: At least design this in grids and tell me what type of grid you're using because that's how I'm doing my dev. I'm using grids, using Lumos, like 12 columns, 10 columns, 16, whatever. And that's the only kind of request that I say to my designers. And I don't like to kind of give like a lot of creative people rules. I just kind of give them a direction. Hey, this is like, more into kind of modern tech brand for example so this is the typeface that are going to be like kind of suitable for the brand this is the type of imagery or the or the feeling that I want you do you everything like

18:28Bimo Tri: Including the animation or interaction if they have one like hey let's do this let's go let's do it

18:35Janne Parri: Nice. Actually, my next question would have been about those animations. Like, at what point they come into the picture? Because I have seen your work and there are like very big and cool animations. And it would be hard to put those in a static canvas. So at what point those come into picture and do you like... Brainstorm those with the designer or does the designer come up with those and yeah, how do you do those?

19:05Bimo Tri: Usually, if we are talking about prototyping the kind of interaction, I'd rarely do that if it's like my own kind of project and I do the design myself. But if I were to work with someone, I would love them to like at least... Putting out some references as a website or not even a website though. Like it could be like something they see on Pinterest or maybe even like a YouTube videos or something else. Just give it to me if you can record some stuff and then we can then iterate or explore based off of that.

19:40Bimo Tri: That come much later, I guess, during the projects. Ideally, after everything is finished, after the high fidelity or maybe all the skin have been done, and let's explore that. But I'm pretty much open though. Mean, if during the design process that... I, if I design the website myself, I came across something I would go jump straight away into Webflow and just explore stuff. Like straight away. I, because I tend to procrastinate a lot. So that's why

20:08Janne Parri: You

20:09Bimo Tri: I'm just like, okay, let's just spinning out some stuff that I can maybe use or maybe not. So if it's like with a designer and and they have like some ideas during the process like let's explore that so yeah I mean depends

20:25Janne Parri: Yeah, that's the thing with the coolest and newest stuff that you kind of have to have some sort of proof of concept. You have to like do something that you know that it will work. And oftentimes you get excited about that and you realize that you haven't done the actual design. You have just played around with the workflow. But yeah, I feel that. I feel that too. Quick side notes here. So I have already booked a bunch of guests for the show. So if you are liking what you're hearing and seeing, please consider subscribing. I am also doing live streams on YouTube. So check the schedule from my channel and come and say hi while I'm live. That's all on with the show.

21:11Janne Parri: What about like, well, we talked about the work with designers, but do you do like work with studios, agencies and what sort of clients mix do you have?

21:23Bimo Tri: Right now the client dynamics that I have right now is one with an agency and two devs for them and one is for like a direct client doing this on dev. So yeah, I do like partner up with some agencies that I'm under an NDA. I cannot say that. But yeah. Mostly they're requesting some dev assistance and readily designed, but mostly dev doing some custom coding.

21:49Janne Parri: That is nice. NDA sounds mysterious and cool. But do you prefer one or the other? If you could choose would you do like own clients or more of those agency stuff or which would you prefer?

22:04Bimo Tri: I mean direct client is not always better but working with the agency was also cool depends on depends on who you're working with by the way I mean right now I'm working with one of the top guys not necessarily one of the top guys but pretty well known in the design space. His studio or agency is one of the kind of most sought after in the US. At least not necessarily like that but let's just say one of the top player guys and it's a great agency and I love that doing creative stuff and we explore a bunch of stuff and working with my current client right now is also

22:48Bimo Tri: It's a cool experience. Like, I don't know, this year has been really great. For me, the client is like open to my direction and they actually trusted me with everything. That's rare. And they pay a lot. So,

22:59Janne Parri: Good.

23:00Bimo Tri: So yeah. And they don't demand

23:01Janne Parri: Yeah, that's

23:02Bimo Tri: Like lot of stuff. So yeah.

23:05Janne Parri: Nice. So that's the client you go all in and spend all your nights doing the stuff. Yeah, obviously some folks like the agency work because they do not have to do like the sales or anything like that. They do not have to get the client, but if you have the clients coming to you, obviously that's not that hard and you might enjoy your own clients. But I'm curious. How did you get to know those agencies or how did they find you? Did you have some sort of like efforts to get to that agency work?

23:42Bimo Tri: Network strangely enough like mostly being active on social like LinkedIn Twitter and just to connect with a lot of different studios that you admire it helps a though like I've no idea that this agency or person will be my client because of I'm engaging with someone that they know of and someone that they know of eventually recommending me to them as a developer. So mostly my clientele right now is through network with a lot of cool people like just engaging on

24:19Bimo Tri: On their content and whatnot. It's not necessarily like I selling them my service. I engage with their content because it's purely I love the content. It's not like hey it's not on purpose that I wanna I wanna job. It's just like I don't care if they give me like a like a lead or something. I don't give a fuck. I engage with people's content is because I either I like it or I want to say something if not then I don't really like I really posting some stuff like entrepreneurial like thought leadership posts on every social that I have like I hate that kind of thing I just wanted

24:59Bimo Tri: To I just want to post like if I want to post something like a milestone of my career or live, I will do that but mostly my posts are like work stuff, networking with people that I like and that gave me like a lot of leads strangely enough but I'm very grateful that it happened that way, you know what I mean but yeah

25:23Janne Parri: Yeah. That's a cool, like, obviously the social media has a lot of potential, but you have to be active on that. So do you do more like engaging, with other folks stuff or how much do you post, about your stuff or do you have any, Goals to post weekly daily or anything like that or is it just like organic as you said before?

25:49Bimo Tri: This is like organic dude. Like if I don't have like a post in a month, I don't. ⁓ If I don't have to post, if I don't ⁓ have something ⁓ to show ⁓ like ⁓ exploration or maybe client project, I don't. ⁓ It's not like I do like forcing or maybe I should starting to like ⁓ kind of plan that stuff ahead. But right now I don't. Like a fixed schedule to engage with other people to engage with ⁓ to ⁓ post something on LinkedIn or Twitter or any of the social media it is organic, purely organic like ⁓ engaging with people's stuff like and it just being social and social media essentially ⁓ really like

26:31Bimo Tri: Right it's simple though you don't have to kind of premeditate everything. I'm going to approach this person because this person is like CEO of this company. Then eventually they'll become a current. Fuck that shit, man. It's kind of been fake and i mean it's okay but it's not how i wanted to work let's just say this like particular company has a lot of budget to spend with like they have like hundreds if not hundreds thousands of dollars for like a project or a website

27:03Bimo Tri: Like if I don't like the company or maybe even the person itself just how they behave online I wouldn't do shit. I even going to block them even though they're giving away a job or maybe even though they want to hire me. I don't care and that's just me. It's not like the best approach. It's just my approach but yeah dude

27:22Janne Parri: Yeah, it's probably like you are playing the long game. So you are being active. Whenever you have something to post, you post and so on. Maybe the pressure to post or meditate everything beforehand comes when people are trying to get their first client or the next client and they are in desperate need. Of some clients so then they are like

27:48Bimo Tri: Dude, I did that at the start, the beginning of my career after I switched from like working, sorry, SEO, working in agency and then desperately need a client. Hey, like I'm approaching people just because I want to work. It's almost guarantee. I mean, it's not almost guarantee, but it just happened to me that it doesn't work. I didn't get the client or I do get the client, but a bad one. Like they demand a lot of like changes. They didn't pay a lot. Right. So I learned my mistake. So instead of like forcing myself like sounded desperate, client can smell that if you desperately

28:25Bimo Tri: Need some work and they're going to abuse it. Like at least that's how I experienced it. That's what my experience like if they if you're showing like kind of quote-unquote weakness or like you're not confident or maybe you're just kind desperate my god man that's they can immediately know okay this person needs like job like i can do like a lot of stuff with like with less money i mean not always the case though by the way so so yeah

28:55Janne Parri: Yeah, that's the conflict with sales. You kind of want the job, but you have to appear like you don't need it. Or the best case is obviously if you don't need it, but when you are in the position that you desperately need it, do you have the nerves to say like, okay, I can walk away from this one if needed? That takes balls. One has

29:19Bimo Tri: I mean,

29:20Janne Parri: To look at those Christo videos before says calls like Jack did

29:25Bimo Tri: Yeah, yeah. I mean I did I walk away from job like that base well doing basically Webflow dev like a couple of times just because I don't like the job and I don't know if I should regret it or not, but I'm approaching it or maybe I'm seeing it as a learning curve for me. We've never known the client will be a quote bad client or a very demanding one before we jumpstart the project. Sometimes they might seem very nice, very trusting.

29:57Bimo Tri: Before we kick off the project and then after the project gets like 20 % going and then they starting to be like an asshole. That happens quite often, but yeah, but yeah dude, mean, depends.

30:08Janne Parri: Yeah, you live and learn. But hey, since you have the SEO background, how's your SEO game right now? Do you do any SEO efforts or even engine optimization, the new buzzword?

30:23Bimo Tri: Yeah, I've tried to get into that but I don't. campaign SEO wise, like doing it like the way I did back when I was like kind of like kind of SEO guy and affiliate might not work because Google updated shit every single year or even months even like their algorithm changes like and that's why I just did like a very minimal SEO friendly stuff on my web. At least if people searching for my name, it's get discovered at the Google and that's it. Then I don't like running SEO campaign, but articles and stuff like that. But I don't know, probably my SEO game sucks right now, but I don't care.

31:05Janne Parri: You just need like one good channel to get, those leads. So for some it might be the SEO or Google for some it is like social media channels. Yeah. Yeah. Someone,

31:17Bimo Tri: So much be paid. Right?

31:21Janne Parri: Someone might like go big on Instagram or something like that. I don't know, but you do not have to like do all of them. Obviously again, if you are desperate, you kind of feel that whatever works first. That's the thing.

31:35Bimo Tri: Yeah, by the way, this is kinda mind-boggling to me at least, so I have a friend in Bali, from the UK. He didn't have a fucking Instagram for his studio, and yet he's running a six-figure web design. And not just a web design, but a design business in Bali. How fucking crazy is that? The leads are essentially from the network of people in Bali or maybe in UK, but do this network a lot, crazy a lot. And he always get the job. And that proves to me that you...

32:10Bimo Tri: Don't necessarily have like a strong quote-unquote social media presence to get client or maybe I mean it's good if you if you do by the way if you have like a strong personal brand like Chris Do or maybe someone like if you know jasmine alex the link in guy i don't know if you know if you know him

32:28Janne Parri: Yeah, yeah. I've probably seen him.

32:31Bimo Tri: It's great it's a plus and your content game and plus the network is going to it's going to brought you a lot of leads but my point is you don't necessarily have like a strong or maybe again to piggyback our conversation about like the leads you don't have to like actively force yourself to post every single week just to get to stay in the game if that makes sense so

33:01Bimo Tri: It can be like lot of channels to bring those leads. So yeah.

33:06Janne Parri: Totally. And your example with the non-existing Instagram for a design agency good because you kind of would imagine that sort of agency would be on a creative social media like Instagram. But then if you think it through, it is a B2B business. Obviously there are people doing the decisions, but they might not be always on Instagram and LinkedIn might

33:36Bimo Tri: You

33:36Janne Parri: Be just better for them if you choose just one platform and you mentioned all the referrals. So obviously in Instagram, people usually like to be entertained. It might not be the best place to sell. Sell services. But I'm kind of curious since we are on this topic of social media. So which social media do you prefer? You mentioned that you post on LinkedIn and Twitter. What's your opinion on all the platforms and which one you prefer?

34:09Bimo Tri: Okay, context. Is it for design or work or is it like for my personal

34:15Janne Parri: Let's start with the work type of stuff.

34:17Bimo Tri: Work i personally love LinkedIn to kind of been active to be social on LinkedIn and instagram and the least favorite or actually i'm being there just because of like i just like want to have like a presence is twitter it's fucking trash like it's like

34:36Janne Parri: No.

34:37Bimo Tri: It's going to be depend on instagram it kind of always like kind of been trashed if you happen just to stumble upon post that you hate and Twitter is far even worse like sometimes the people you follow or maybe even people you like in your Twitter network, reposting stuff and then you just happen to see that and then it gets piled and then it's snowballing like a lot of random political stuff and bad stuff. Like I really hate that. And the best one is LinkedIn. It's kept, it's professional. Like my home

35:11Bimo Tri: Feed is now full of like design and development and then that's it. No political bullshit and meme and all that kind of doom scrolling fucking bullshit that's going to spend like at least an hour right it's gonna take your time so so yeah link in to answer your question it's my favorite and for personal let me piggyback it's instagram because like most of people are using Instagram like just to network with a lot of my friends from schools and my old friends are using Instagram and then that's it.

35:48Janne Parri: Yeah, yeah, that is true that on Instagram you do still follow your friends and you DM those friends and so on. And LinkedIn is more like professional thing. And no one hangs out in Facebook. So obviously you friends back there, but no one uses that. But people might not like LinkedIn because as you said, there might be those self-improvement type of folks. And those might be the first posts

36:20Janne Parri: That you see when you get on the platform. But as you said, if you follow the right people, your feed will be like curated to your liking, obviously. So I like LinkedIn too, but yeah. Let's see.

36:36Bimo Tri: But you can block that post though. I... Like, even ads, like sometimes you get random fucking ads like that does not relate to you at all. Right? Like, what is it like about oil and gas company? I'm like, what the fuck are you doing in my

36:54Janne Parri: You

36:55Bimo Tri: Feed? Right? What is it? Like, I... I report the ad because it's not relevant to my algorithm. Was like, okay. And I can mute and not necessarily mute people, but block people on LinkedIn. If I saw something like, hey, I learned this and this and that. The buzzwords and the hot topics from 2025, actually 2024 until today, AI. I built this shit with Claude Code in 10 minutes. Fucking bullshit. Like you.

37:24Janne Parri: You

37:24Bimo Tri: Don't first of all that's bullshit like you prompted in like you need at least an hour to play around with it like I immediately muted them or maybe they do I mean maybe they did like create that landing page or whatever the fuck that is in 10 minutes I don't care I immediately like kind of block them or mute them on LinkedIn, I forgot what is it called, but yeah, like kind of that rage baiting and then eventually in their post, they're gonna sell you something, they're gonna sell something, DM me something or comment

37:57Bimo Tri: With whatever the fuck and then I'm going to DM you this. I was like, nah, that's too good to be true.

38:02Janne Parri: You

38:03Bimo Tri: Thank you.

38:04Janne Parri: Yeah, I have been thinking that. That something I should do? But it gets a bit like weird and icky. So maybe we should just do like, as you said, organic. You have something to show, then you can do the post. Yeah.

38:22Bimo Tri: But strangely enough dude, that... That... That... That... That bullshit post... Is making money. It... It... It did, you know? I mean, the craziest part is that people are going into that kind of bullshit. That... It... It might sound like icky to us, like... God, whatever... What it is, like... But that dude that... Or maybe that girl or maybe that very person that doing that... Making money off of it and the posts get a lot of engagement and then get pushed to my feet because it's got a lot of traction right so I was like ah I mean you do you but I'm gonna black you anyway so yeah bye like I don't

39:01Bimo Tri: Care whatever it is that you do

39:03Janne Parri: Okay, since you mentioned I have to ask what kind of AI tools you use and for what purposes.

39:15Bimo Tri: Okay, cloud, I used to use cursor but switching to Claude Code now very recently, probably just like a week or two weeks in for most of my coding stuff. So I just get to like review my code and I still code like manually, especially when it comes to like interaction or animation, like you cannot vibe code that. Like it doesn't have that animation taste like you do as a person, as a human being who can feel, who can see, right? It's a algorithm, it's one and zero, it's a machine. And the other one probably right now, probably the least, right now at least mid journey to generate like assets and placeholder for my clients so that they get.

40:01Bimo Tri: For example, like this is a great use cases of mid journey. My client needs like a kind of photography direction. Obviously I'm pulling from a mood board and references from like a real brand, but I also generate AI image using mid journey and use that product as a context with the mood that I've gathered, that I gathered from like, right? So it's not like... First of all, it's always best to use like a real photography. It's using AI as a references or maybe just to get some ideas going. That's how I've been doing it. It's not like an ages like the final product.

40:37Bimo Tri: Whether it's visual or whether it's code. It's a good starting point, BAI.

40:42Janne Parri: Yeah, totally. And that's a good tip that you can give whatever you have found to that point and generate me something that works well with this mood or this style. That's a good thing. About the coding stuff and interactions, I wonder if there is a person who wants to get into more complex interactions like GSAP. And they are not a coder, but they want to start

41:14Janne Parri: Doing some stuff with GSAP. What would you advise to them? Where should they start? Should they like, vibe code some GSAP code or should they use the Webflow interaction stuff and learn that first or do everything at the same time?

41:31Bimo Tri: Okay, that's a good question and if I'm going to speak this for myself ⁓ if ⁓ I were to get to like had to start again. I would probably going to exhaust every single thing in the native GSAP in Webflow until I hit a ceiling like a wall because that's what actually did happen to me back then. If you hit like a ceiling or control, again, I'm missing control. That's why I got all of the interaction or maybe whatever functionality that I need in my websites. You're eventually going to learn something either like through Claude Code or something.

42:13Bimo Tri: Like you're going to end up like learning javascript and html and css eventually but if you're just getting started just use native Webflow. It's already been doing it's crazy powerful webflow right now with GSAP ⁓ and a lot of like native stuff you don't have to ⁓ you don't have to code if you want to build like a more interactive stuff, but if you want to take it to the next level, yeah, obviously you have to code, you have to learn web programming, you have to know like how the browser renders all of that ⁓ DOM element, the node trees and, but yeah... Just learn the fundamentals of basic in Webflow. ⁓

42:55Bimo Tri: And then take step by step, okay, if I want to add something, page transition for example, page transition are still needed like little snippets of JavaScript to make that happen, to make that seamlessly transitioning between pages and yeah, and then start from there and then learn from watching YouTube videos, maybe take some courses and yeah.

43:17Janne Parri: Yeah. I would agree with that because the Webflow interactions is quite powerful. It just got some nice little

43:23Bimo Tri: You.

43:24Janne Parri: Updates and you could do a lot with that. You can split the text and you have integrations to drive

43:30Bimo Tri: Teeheehee!

43:32Janne Parri: And spline and all that.

43:33Bimo Tri: Yeah, life too.

43:35Janne Parri: Yeah. So, so you can really do a lot with that. You might. Find that you do not even have to do custom stuff for your use case. Yeah.

43:45Bimo Tri: You might not need it at all, right? For you, this case is if you don't want to build like super crazy or winning or whatever it is like experience, you don't, especially most client projects that needs to like have some basic split text animation or just some reveal stuff, just do it natively in Webflow. Just don't add more complexity to your projects,

44:07Janne Parri: Hmm, yeah.

44:08Bimo Tri: Especially if your project already... Kind of have like a lot of requirement to integrate like a lot of third party stuff important that's very important notes that sometimes adding that third party that you don't have control can slow your side load speeds down and Adding another custom coding not necessarily that you need that you don't necessarily need with just doing some basic stuff animation can also puts a burden into your site load speed. Yeah, I just use native stuff, especially if you integrate a lot of marketing channels and Google tech managers, Facebook pixels and all that.

44:48Bimo Tri: HubSpot and you just don't add complexity to, if you don't need it. Mean, but if you can, it's cool. I'm not saying you can, but yeah.

44:58Janne Parri: Yeah, yeah. One specific use case was on my mind. I was wondering, I was doing some CSS animation and I was like, wondering if I should do it with the GSAP thing or with the CSS, because I was already

45:12Bimo Tri: Hmm.

45:13Janne Parri: Like loading the GSAP and I was wondering if it would be all the same for the loading speed. To just make it with GSAP instead of CSS. Do you have any like insight about that type of consideration?

45:28Bimo Tri: If you're doing something ⁓ let me track back for a second ⁓ so this is i pick up knowledge that i pick up from ⁓ one of GSAP teacher let's just say creative coding club by Carl Schuf ⁓ his name is Carl Schuf and one of the students asked ⁓ if it's like you just said ⁓ Is it better like a CSS animation with the translator and all that in GSAP? And so he did a small experimentation. Like basically GSAP, like ⁓ it's a JavaScript programming language to move all of that. But in the background, what actually happening is it's like a CSS transition, not CSS transition, but JavaScript animation. And it's not kind of big of a difference in terms of performance, quote unquote, ⁓ but JavaScript can...

46:14Bimo Tri: Has a lot more potentials and complexities to be added on. Like if you want to have this menu open and then this, and the other side of the, some elements hiding or you want to stop scrolling when the menu is open, that is JavaScript. But if you're basic hover effect or even like some open model menus, nowadays you can do it with CSS, just do it with CSS. It's a lot more browser friendly because it's rendered or maybe it's processed in the GPU rather than the GPU itself and I don't know I could be wrong though but yeah just use CSS for some basic stuff like hover and a lot of small stuff and load the more complex

46:58Bimo Tri: Animation or functionalities to JavaScript.

47:01Janne Parri: Yeah, yeah. And obviously if you are the only one editing. Is easy for you to know

47:06Bimo Tri: Hmm

47:07Janne Parri: Every, everything you have done. But if there are other people, you should like documentation or some sort of guide where everything is.

47:17Bimo Tri: You

47:17Janne Parri: And at that point, it might be simpler if all the things are

47:22Bimo Tri: You

47:23Janne Parri: At the same place or done with the same thing if it is not that big of a difference, the loading speed or the performance. But I was thinking before this one, a Webflow is great for learning like CSS and HTML. You like learn the logic. And I was wondering if the interaction tool would be a good ⁓ way to learn GSAP. In a way, there is the same logic. And you said that one could start with that. ⁓ But all the stuff you need for the actual custom coding, ⁓ there is still quite a long gap. Would you agree?

48:04Bimo Tri: Yeah, yeah, it is. But Webflow is a fun way to learn web programming visually though. Let's just say that, right? You learn styling using Webflow panels. Okay, this is div. So what that does, and this is the markup or the HTML elements in this left panel, and you can add section. Can add div, you can add like a form, this is like a nav. You eventually will learn ⁓ a lot of ⁓ developer terms or maybe the basic web programming using Webflow. That's why I said like exhaust everything in the native Webflow. ⁓

48:41Bimo Tri: Either functional or interaction stuff before you jumping into custom code. Jumping into custom code only if you hit like a ceiling. And it depends on the ceiling itself. It depends on like how I might have to nest like five CMS collection under one collection and that requires JavaScript to do so obviously, right? And I need to filter. This based off of this and actually Webflow just recently launched like a an upgraded quote-unquote conditional visibility and I've been abusing it's quite powerful actually

49:16Bimo Tri: It's quite good it can filter based off if this set and then i want to have this and then if this set is on i'm you're not having writing a javascript right so again that's exhausted the webflow native capabilities first especially now the way people build are getting I'd say lot more complex with the component properties. I'm still kind of adjusting myself. Like I used to build like a pretty loose build. Like sometimes I don't want to have that constraint that, okay, this is component and then the layout are...

49:56Bimo Tri: Kind of limiting layout, but Timothy Ricks has proven that wrong. Again, it's crazy stuff, but yeah. ⁓ And if you can do well with the native Webflow capabilities, especially with the building with the page slots component, you're gonna do great. ⁓ Obviously, and I'm sure of that.

50:14Janne Parri: There's been a of talk, well, on this show also about the components and all the cool stuff we can do with those. Like, as you said, the visibility settings, I was playing around with those just today. I knew that is like very handy. But now I like understood

50:36Bimo Tri: Sorry.

50:36Janne Parri: When I did some component work and just wanted to like conditionally show something and I didn't have to use any tricks for that. So that is cool. And you mentioned Lumos and Timothy Ricks. And yeah, obviously that is a cool framework and very developer friendly framework. So how did you end up using Lumos and have you checked if any other frameworks would be suitable for you?

51:06Bimo Tri: I was not using any frameworks. I tried Finsweet back then, didn't like it because it's sketchy. No offense, Finsweet are great guys. Alex, Iglesias are great developers and the way they did it, they must have had some reason why. The way they built style, let's just say that. I don't like it. It's particularly because like, you just get too much wrapper just to have some padding. Was like, fuck that. Like I don't want to have

51:33Janne Parri: You

51:33Bimo Tri: That on my build. And then eventually learning Lumos after Tim introducing grid, the way we built using column span. And then we can accurately. Placing our contents accordingly to the grid cell itself or the grid column itself. That totally changed the way I built and the way I designed. So the way I do my stuff right now, if I build it or design it in 12 column in my Figma, I will do it in 12 column in my workflow and so on. Like I have like...

52:06Bimo Tri: Couple of projects that are in 10 column grids. The designers design, I asked them in 10 column grids and then I built it in 10 column grids and actually one of my last exploration was in 16 column. I just wanted to push it like how far building with grids can do and yeah dude it's yeah that's one of the biggest takeaway or maybe the biggest plus point for me at least using Lumos. I'm still using the old Lumos by the way, not the newer stuff with the patch slots and then the component stuff.

52:42Bimo Tri: I'm just still, let's just say I'm taking those from Lumos and making my own kind of build style but yeah, slowly adapting. To the component build style.

52:53Janne Parri: Well, I believe that everyone is like trying to make it work in a way everyone is seeing like the bright future where you can just put components into slots and easily build all sorts of layouts and give the control to your client to some marketer who wants to build a page. But it is still a lift you have to do all those components and even then if you build cool components you have to teach the client to use them. It is easier and you can do it with the build mode but it's still a learning curve and every system is like unique. But I was thinking about the Lumos. I'm just like getting into it and I...

53:41Bimo Tri: You

53:41Janne Parri: I use the newest version and they're the... Nice.

53:44Bimo Tri: Yeah, I that on your live build show on YouTube. I was like, okay, dude is trying to get into Lumos. Nice. I was like, yeah, welcome. It takes like a bit, the learning curve is a bit steep, especially if you're not familiar with building with like component, because steam does it in a way where you style the layout in the component. That's where it gets tricky, right? Like the syntaxes and the classes gets a bit kind of hard to learn. But once you get the hang of it's quite powerful kind of system, as you say.

54:23Janne Parri: Totally. Yeah, I already can see

54:25Bimo Tri: You

54:26Janne Parri: That. And yeah, there are so many like little things that you have to like check what is this about during your first build. But I was thinking that those columns, you

54:37Bimo Tri: Bye.

54:38Janne Parri: Mentioned that you tried like 16 column layout. And I saw that in the newest version, the column counts they are in variables and there's a max number for variable modes for specific variable and that

54:53Bimo Tri: 12.

54:54Janne Parri: Is 12. Yeah. And I was thinking, is that just like the gap for future to come or is it, is it something that

55:03Bimo Tri: You

55:03Janne Parri: Needs to be addressed? I don't know, but might be a limitation for you.

55:06Bimo Tri: I... Yeah, maybe I'm just stupid enough to try 16 column quiz. Know what I mean? Because, yeah, as you mentioned, like, Webflow Variables pack right now, it has like a kind of. Sorry, variable mode is like, they only allows you to have like a kind of 12 items in it. And Lumos, the newest version, using the column count. From that variable so that you can have it set in your layout and then you just can toggle how many columns do you wanna have in your grids. In the older version of Lumos, Tim actually still embedded a CSS custom so you can have like a far grid 12, 10 something and then you can customize it and that's what I'm still.

55:56Bimo Tri: Using to this day because I can custom everything I can have like 20 column grids if I wanted to but there's not a limitation per se I think 12 column is enough like lots of great design whether it's award-winning or just like a simple elegant good web design you probably don't need like that many great columns and 12 is pretty enough and the way Tim did it if you really following his kind of build style it's gonna be easier to lay out but it's just not my style though building in component like using

56:32Janne Parri: You

56:34Bimo Tri: In slots I was like content wrapper I was like okay that's it for me I mean I'm kind of in the, in the boat of close component per team say like, so one layout, I make it like a component, but the user or maybe my client can swap the image or maybe I made like a two component variants of the, of that particular section. So one variant. Let's just say the image on the left and then the other variance is the image on the right and the content or text are heading on the left. It's just something like that. So it's just like, it's not as complex as what he did, but yeah, I'm slowly adapting, but yeah.

57:17Janne Parri: Yeah, there's a lot of talk and opinions about like open versus closed components and yeah, I haven't made my mind i'm still thinking that maybe we should have both in the project so we have the have the static components with the properties some editing Possibilities for those and then we should have some sort of open section components and open layout or grid within that and that could be the middle road but yeah,

57:49Janne Parri: My opinion is still like in the works it's developing and yeah obviously the Lumos thing is cool and I'm getting like excited about all the open components you can use and all the things you can do with those but again it takes a little bit of learning for the client to actually use those. So I'm a bit skeptical. Yeah.

58:11Bimo Tri: Yeah, especially for the client dude.

58:15Janne Parri: How well. Yeah.

58:15Bimo Tri: Even us, even us developers having hard time understanding whatever it is, like, okay. So let's take for example, sliders in Lumos MD like ILG like des ilg.md like if you give it to client, will your client understand like what the fuck is that? This is basically just to set like a grid column for or even the client. I'm in the same world as you. Like I'm a bit skeptical to having to leaving all of the control to the client, especially like sliders or maybe things that are often get messy if clients doing some mistakes or.

59:01Bimo Tri: Something like that but again dude that's totally probably not all the case or i don't know i don't know but yeah i'm still a bit skeptical to leaving all that open component and then you have you teach the client to all of to add that kind of component into the slots and then the content wrapper and then the diff wrapper and then this is how you style them and then okay, one caveat though, if your client is a big enterprise client, maybe they have their own team to handle the development and that will be like a lot more make sense because if your client is like an enterprise six figures whatever client they have their own team to manage the workflow itself.

59:44Bimo Tri: Must have some background in development or maybe in Webflow itself. They just need ⁓ the ⁓ Lumos ⁓ type system to kind of help them to build the system itself. And then they can run it on their, with their team, right? If it's like ⁓ a direct CEO client that aren't so technical ⁓ or maybe not even technically at all. That's hard. ⁓ The most ⁓

1:00:08Janne Parri: Total.

1:00:09Bimo Tri: Like the, they probably are going to change the swap, image for maybe to change some copies and that's it. They are going to kind of doing some crazy stuff with it. But yeah.

1:00:21Janne Parri: I talked about this with Hal Zeitlin and I believe they have some sort of own version of Lumos and he phrased it quite well. ⁓ said that Lumos is very developer friendly and what they are trying to do, they are trying to make it as marketer friendly as they can. So they are probably editing. ⁓ taking away some complexities and naming things like in a certain way so that the marketer has a chance to actually use the use the framework. Yeah.

1:00:53Bimo Tri: Oh yeah, that's, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because that's, if we are developers, we are oftentimes naming our classes or maybe components like in our terms as a dev, not necessarily as a marketers like, hey, this is a section, what the fuck is that. If you're a marketers or maybe even someone who hasn't had any prior experience in... Web dev it's going to be totally alien to them right and ⁓ the way Tim did as ⁓ as Hal mentioned is probably to for the marketing team to understand like ⁓ okay this is for the heading type ⁓ the heading component okay this is a button to simplify all that but again I'm still a bit skeptical but it is like it's probably only it's me ⁓

1:01:43Bimo Tri: Who feels that eventually it's going to be me in the end who are going to make edits... Or just like my past prayer client that doesn't need that complex of a system so they can build on their own.

1:01:54Janne Parri: But imagine if you have a good open system, and your client asks that, you add a section with some sort of basic content? And you are like magician because you do it in five minutes or less. OK. OK. We have talked about quite nerdy stuff.

1:02:14Bimo Tri: You

1:02:14Janne Parri: About workflow and components. That's great. But let's change gears a bit. I want to talk about awards because you have been, on both sides of the awards system, and I'm like curious if there are people, looking at cool award sites and sites that win some other. Other trophies and they wanna get to that level. What should they focus on?

1:02:40Bimo Tri: That's a lot dude. To win some... To win the... That's... That's... It's not just design. You can win by design, obviously, but your dev skills or maybe the interaction or maybe the creativity of the website itself, it's just big also. Yeah, I don't know. I mean... Focusing on the design maybe or focusing on the dev skills itself depends on who you are and what you want to focus on your career obviously if you are doing design only design study typography go learn

1:03:11Bimo Tri: The old designers what they're doing, like go deep into the history of design itself and that's going to help you a lot. And if you're doing deaf, obviously go study from the... People have already won some awards, like the kind of big studio or maybe the big individuals on awards, like how do their stuff, I mean, how do they do what they did? Mean, technology-wise, are they using WebGL in their websites or how do they do that? Inspect their websites? I even go as far as like...

1:03:46Bimo Tri: If I like something I recorded in my MacBook or maybe ⁓ I took like a video recording and I slow them down to learn ⁓ the sequence ⁓ of the animation ⁓ like, okay, this is scale. ⁓ Yeah, how many seconds? Like, okay, all this is the using, are using something powerful in app or ⁓ whatever, ⁓ right? ⁓ And the total length of the animation is 2. Something seconds. Like I go pretty hard in that so and that's

1:04:19Bimo Tri: Why I keep I keep learning a lot of new stuff but I don't nowadays because I'm I already probably, you can say, like, built the skills to like, okay, this is the animation, this is something, but I did still like the recording, but I don't go pretty, I don't spend myself, I don't spend like too much time like I was back in still when I was still learning, like slowing them down and... Doing all that, but yeah, that's going to help you. Like study the design, study the type, study the color, study the interactions, study the technology itself. And yeah, and that can get you pretty far, actually. And always experimenting,

1:04:58Janne Parri: Thing with many. Yeah. That's the thing with, well, many creative fields. You have to like learn and maybe even copy and grow your skills. And after that, you can come up with some original stuff. Obviously you can try it, try it before, but it is way easier after you have the skills. Like to whip up something that has never been seen.

1:05:25Bimo Tri: Like it's not like everything ⁓ like you cannot claim something to be uniquely yourself like Austin Kleon put it perfectly like still like an artist like basically everything has been established or maybe has been made. Like you don't invent a fucking circle, ⁓ a circle shape right it's been around for fucking ⁓ thousands of years like ⁓ the way you can do about it is like is ⁓ how do they approach this circle symbol logo or whatever or the R logo and how can I do something about it that makes it truly mine instead of just like a copy and pasting it but something that helps me a lot with my kind of learning process doing specifically creative dev is that I recreated them.

1:06:11Bimo Tri: Literally 2DT seconds by seconds like every detail I copied a lot so I can understand like why they are doing it that specific way and I did learn it from again from copying Joseph Berry the courses itself is to copy his side and I took that process still until today, they copy if I wanted to learn something from other devs, like, okay, how do they doing this WebGL page transition, for example, or maybe how do they doing this preloader or why are they using this specific font that are not Helvetica, but totally look like Helvetica. And there is a reason

1:06:50Bimo Tri: For that. There is a reason like designers choosing typefaces, colors, but yeah, that's just my process on how I think about it, I

1:06:59Janne Parri: Yeah, yeah, that is cool.

1:07:01Bimo Tri: Guess.

1:07:01Janne Parri: Maybe I should have asked this before the awards question like, is that even a good goal for designers? If we think of a young designer, maybe more senior designer, should they focus on something else than getting awards? What do you think?

1:07:19Bimo Tri: Dude, this is a great question. I used to have a goal until I kind of letting it go. I have a goal like, I wanna won some awards because there not so much like a player in Indonesia that won some awards side of the day back then. Like now looking it back. Once you walk that side of the day, it's like, okay, you get some leads and then that's it. Once you've hit that, I guess it was for me. The goal probably changes from doing from actually winning the awards to like, I want to make something that I truly proud that I'm proud of. Like it's not.

1:07:59Bimo Tri: Winning some awards or maybe getting recognized by the industry or even designers, I don't care. ⁓ Once I did that, I won the awards and it's like, okay, this is cool. I'd rather right now create something that I'm proud of, ⁓ that I like, that I enjoy, rather than chasing the industry. ⁓ And if you're asking me if someone ⁓ should chase the awards, I don't think they should. Really? I think this is going to be like cliche. I think they should chase like the fulfillment itself after we finish the project. And that can mean a lot of different things. Could be money, could be anything. But if you're enjoying the process of design or maybe the development itself, regardless if you want the awards or not, if you're having fun with it, that's a big win for me, more than the awards itself.

1:08:49Janne Parri: Yeah, yeah. And obviously there might be someone listening to this and like shouting that the awards are for certain types of sites. So if you are in the SEO conversion optimization camp, you're like laughing at the at all the awards. But that's fine. There are sites for different goals and so on. Yeah, yeah. Okay, I believe we have to land this plane at some point, but I still want to ask you about the Webflow community, because that's one of my favorite topics. And you

1:09:30Janne Parri: Are in Indonesia. So do you have any meetups there around Webflow or around some other stuff you might be interested in?

1:09:41Bimo Tri: Specifically Webflow we used to have. So Webflow has been brought a lot of friends to me personally that in Indonesia. So I met a lot of cool people that right now we are having like a little community but most of them are no longer using Webflow. But we've met through Webflow back when I don't know if you're already using Webflow back when Finsweet did a live stream every single week. Raymar are still there.

1:10:11Bimo Tri: That was the golden, quote unquote, days of Webflow community. And we met through there. And the community isn't that strong here necessarily because most of... Let's say I'm not generalizing it, but most of like people in here in a country like mine, in a third world country, especially my country, still consider Webflow is an expensive stuff. The freelancer plan costs, sorry, the agency, my plan, the agency plan costs like 40 something, $49. And that's a lot of money in here.

1:10:46Bimo Tri: I mean, obviously if you make money off of it like me, it's not, it's nothing, right? But for people just to get started to like have a side going, especially if they hit like a ceiling in the free plan, they eventually needed to upgrade and that upgrade is not cheap. And that's why like, the majority of the people here are still doing traditional code with next.js. But right now it's starting to get some traction. I just got back from Bali actually this week. Last week I was spending my entire week in Bali and I've met a of locals that are starting to use Webflow.

1:11:26Bimo Tri: To do some creative stuff and they are liking it and they ask me a lot of stuff so it's starting to grow year by year actually so it's a good thing but it's not like yeah it's not like as big as in the western countries in the US maybe or maybe in the UK where they have like a strong community they they have like an event like flow Manchester if I'm not

1:11:56Bimo Tri: Mistaken, yeah. And yeah, I would love to have fun in here, but yeah, man, I've got a lot of projects to get done. So yeah, the time itself, managing it, like scouting some places, it's not easy.

1:12:12Janne Parri: Yeah, same thing that I believe that a Webflow meetup in Finland will not happen if I do not do that. And I have been talking about it for so long that I kind of feel the pressure to actually do something about it. But Webflow announced like updates for their community stuff like the platform, the grant and the global leader stuff. So I feel I'm like hopeful that they good old days, the Finns with live days and like

1:12:49Janne Parri: The feeling that we had back then will come back and we get to do more stuff

1:12:56Bimo Tri: More community stuff

1:12:56Janne Parri: Meetups and so on.

1:12:57Bimo Tri: Like we used to right so when okay this is this is probably just me i don't know if you want to put it on the live video or not

1:13:06Janne Parri: Bring it on.

1:13:07Bimo Tri: Workflow isn't as community focused as it used to back again when Finsweet doing live streaming every single week or maybe once every two weeks I can't quite remember like everybody's under is under one same roof you've got Flo party with Melissa and then collaborating with Finsweet with Raymar and then everybody just going into one to the same place and it's not like as hype or as it's fun as it used to be I almost feel like that or maybe it's just because of the tool is growing. The consequences of like Webflow keep pushing updates and then eventually they are now focusing more on the big or enterprises rather than the creative designers. Like, but yeah.

1:13:54Janne Parri: That might be one reason, but also like all the AI stuff, cool new tools get the excitement nowadays. So it might be like combination of many factors or something like that.

1:14:06Bimo Tri: But I'm happy Webflow isn't as AI-ify as many other companies, like they wanted to embed everything. Webflow did some AI feature stuff, but it's not the main core focus. I said the world like Replit or maybe lovable where everything is just like agentic, you're vibe coding but we're still you're still doing manually develop in workflow but now it has power to generate or maybe to kickstart some development with the power of the AI and cloud and

1:14:41Bimo Tri: CP right now it's crazy.

1:14:43Janne Parri: It is, and have you actually noticed that Raymar is doing live streams for Replit right now?

1:14:50Bimo Tri: Yeah! Yeah, yeah, he just wanted to... Yeah.

1:14:54Janne Parri: That is, that is cool. But I have a good feeling that Webflow is, Webflow will do some cool stuff with AI. As you mentioned, there's things with Claude. Now there is the Claude connector. So you do not have to use the MCP. You can just use the connector. And with all the components, I have a feeling that if they just like do the obvious stuff with like AI building. They will do good stuff. Hopefully fingers crossed.

1:15:27Janne Parri: Okay, we have a one little funny section at the end, but before that, if people want to check your work, contact you, maybe follow you, where should they go?

1:15:40Bimo Tri: Just start bamoj.com on Google. That's gotta be me. I mean, obviously there is only me in there and I'm mostly active on LinkedIn and Twitter, Instagram and yeah, I think people can check out my work in there. Mean, what else? Awards? No. And yeah, mostly LinkedIn. A lot of my explorations and stuff are in there. My portfolio hasn't been updated for a long time, but yeah, that's the places

1:16:13Bimo Tri: That people can check.

1:16:14Janne Parri: And I will obviously put all the relevant links in the description. Just remember not to do any spammy LinkedIn, Legion posts or Bimo will block you guys.

1:16:24Bimo Tri: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm gonna block you.

1:16:30Janne Parri: Okay. The last section is a funny Finnish section. So I will give you a Finnish phrase or idiom. I will translate that to English and your job is to guess what it means. Is that cool?

1:16:46Bimo Tri: Okay, so you're going to say something in Finnish and then you get translated or something.

1:16:54Janne Parri: Yeah, I'm gonna translate it word to word. So it's gonna be a weird phrase and you're just gonna try to guess what it means. I will give you hints if

1:17:04Bimo Tri: In English.

1:17:05Janne Parri: It's... Yeah, in English. I will say it firstly in Finnish and

1:17:07Bimo Tri: Hey!

1:17:08Janne Parri: Then in English. Okay. Your saying firstly in Finnish is... And the... English translation is cats christening like cats name giving party or something like that. So what does it mean if I say that I have a cat's christening that I have to attend to?

1:17:32Bimo Tri: Damn dude, that's hard. I have no fucking idea. Really I'm

1:17:34Janne Parri: You

1:17:36Bimo Tri: Blanking right now. God, excuse me. Dude, what does that mean? Dude. What?

1:17:41Janne Parri: I give you a hint, it's obviously some sort of event, but what kind of event would it be?

1:17:47Bimo Tri: Can you say that word again, like in Finnish? What was it again?

1:17:50Janne Parri: So, kissa is a cat

1:17:53Bimo Tri: Kiss and kiss.

1:17:55Janne Parri: And christening is ristiäiset.

1:17:57Bimo Tri: Is that with a K or a C? K, right?

1:18:01Janne Parri: Yeah, in Finnish we usually use K, very, very like seldom the C. Give me something.

1:18:07Bimo Tri: What is it?

1:18:09Janne Parri: Will enter your agony after the first kiss.

1:18:12Bimo Tri: He's under the seat of the cat? I don't know, sorry. The what? The... Give it a hint again? Damn, this is hard.

1:18:16Janne Parri: Yeah, so it's some sort of event. What kind of event would

1:18:20Bimo Tri: Some sort of event.

1:18:21Janne Parri: That be? Yeah.

1:18:22Bimo Tri: I'm gonna totally blow it. Blow the fuck out of it. I don't

1:18:24Janne Parri: You

1:18:27Bimo Tri: Know, Christmas? I'm guessing it's gonna be Christmas or something like that. Like, is it like an event? Okay, fuck that.

1:18:31Janne Parri: No, no, it's not a specific event, it's just like some... You can like describe one event, whichever event, with saying that it's a kissanristiäiset, so cat's christening. Do you shoot one more time or will I give you the answer?

1:18:49Bimo Tri: Just give me the answer, I have no fucking idea. I really have no idea.

1:18:53Janne Parri: Yeah, it's quite simple. It just means that it is an unimportant event. So if you get an invite to something that you really do not want to go and you have no reason to go there, but you get invited, you can say that I just got a invite to a cat's christening. Meaning that

1:19:14Bimo Tri: You

1:19:15Janne Parri: It's really weird to have a party for giving a name to a cat. That's the logic behind that.

1:19:23Bimo Tri: Yeah, totally get it now. I rarely like hear someone speaking in Finnish. So it's not totally like, kind of natural for me. But yeah, thank you for the lesson by the way. So yeah, I'm learning every single day.

1:19:35Janne Parri: No way, to do this little Finnish thing at the end of each episode. It's just rooting for the little guys because Finland is not too big of a country. But okay, Bimo, thank you so much for being a guest here and sharing all the wisdom and for the listeners. And for the watchers, we'll see you in the next one. Bye!

1:20:03Bimo Tri: Thank you for having me John. Thank you, bye.